Joko Anwar is no stranger to telling stories that serve as a mirror reflecting Indonesia’s sociopolitical situation. In his folk horror Impetigore, he delves into the topics of poverty and the abuse of power, while his superhero flick Gundala tackles the theme of mass hysteria. It is no surprise that in his 7-episode anthology Netflix series Nightmares and Daydreams, he portrays various everyday situations from his homeland, touching on issues like the struggle of being in a sandwich generation and systemic challenges faced by Indonesian society. Through his distinct narrative style, Anwar confronts pressing issues with a blend of supernatural intrigue and science fiction. In each episode, the show immerses us in compelling tales that not only entertain but provoke thought.

Set between the years 1985 and 2024, the series chronicles the experiences of everyday individuals in Jakarta who encounter peculiar phenomena while simultaneously navigating their struggles. While each episode focuses on different characters, the events depicted throughout the season are interconnected and gradually reveal something more sinister.

In our recent conversation with Anwar, he shed light on the inspirations behind Nightmares and Daydreams. From the show’s inception to the intricacies of character development, Anwar’s meticulous attention to detail underscores his commitment to crafting narratives that resonate on multiple levels. Moreover, his fascination with the aliens adds an intriguing layer to the series, sparking discussions among the audience.

What inspired the story, and when did you develop it?

I have always been captivated by anything related to aliens. My fascination began when I was a kid. As I delved into alien theories, I came across a particularly intriguing idea: aliens might not come from outer space but from within the Earth. When I first read about the hollow earth theory, I discovered a belief in Western occultism and esotericism about a place called Agartha—a hidden world inside the Earth with its own inhabitants, government, and energy sources. Combining this information with my own stories and characters sparked my interest in creating Nightmares and Daydreams.

I’ve always wanted to create a science fiction series, but I find that most existing sci-fi stories are either too “detached” from the audience, particularly Indonesian viewers, or they focus heavily on futuristic concepts. Therefore, if I were to make a science fiction film or series, I want the story to be more grounded.

You could say the idea for Nightmares and Daydreams has been around for a long time. I even composed the opening soundtrack during my sophomore year in college, using a friend’s computer. The concept had been in development for years, but it wasn’t until 2021 that I had the chance to collaborate with Netflix, who gave me the green light for the series. All those ideas and personal obsessions with aliens finally came together when Netflix said yes.

You have been involved in various TV projects before, such as HBO Asia’s Halfworld and A Mother’s Love, and you’re also a producer on Disney+’s Tira. However, most of your previous work was in the film medium. Are there any differences in your approach when it comes to making a film and a series?

It’s certainly very different because, when making a film, the story is typically concluded within 90-120 minutes. For a series, our focus must be on maintaining the premise and keeping the audience engaged over a longer period, at least until the end of one season. This way, viewers watch the entire story, not just a single episode, and are left wanting more by the season’s end. The challenge lies in crafting a compelling story over an extended duration.

The budget for series is notably lower than for films, at least in Indonesia. Given this limitation, we must be creative to maintain high production value. Audiences don’t care about budget constraints; they expect quality content. Therefore, in producing a series, we must find ways to ensure excellent production quality and, most importantly, keep the viewers engaged throughout.

When comparing film and TV formats today, I believe the lines between them have significantly blurred in storytelling and presentation. There were clear differences in the past, such as in Indonesia, where TV shows had to have a fast pace to keep viewers from changing channels. However, the approach is nearly the same, as most series have become more cinematic.

Are there any other science fiction series or films used as references during the making of Nightmares and Daydreams?

Regarding format, I took cues from The Twilight Zone, and regarding the storytelling approach, The X-Files is also a big inspiration. These influences are particularly noticeable in Nightmares and Daydreams. What stands out to me about The Twilight Zone is the show’s ability to start each episode with something ordinary and relatable, only to delve into bizarre, mysterious, and otherworldly situations. Likewise, in Nightmares and Daydreams, each episode begins with something familiar and grounded, but as the narrative progresses, it transports the viewers to unexpected realms they had never seen before.

Nightmares and Daydreams draws parallels with The X-Files in exploring similar phenomena. However, our series focuses on addressing issues highly relevant to modern Indonesia—such as poverty, challenges faced by the sandwich generation, domestic violence, job market struggles, and how many Indonesians are still caught in corporate systems. Although the stories and characters depict the everyday situation in Indonesia, some of the issues we explore are also highly relevant internationally—universal issues told through a distinctly Indonesian perspective. Perhaps because of this, we managed to break into the Top 10 Most Watched lists in several other countries as well.

Speaking of the themes explored in Nightmares and Daydreams—did these ideas originally emerge first, and then you built the main narrative around them, or did they organically develop alongside the narrative?

While developing the story, I crafted a bible outlining what Agartha is like, what Indonesia is like, and what the Earth is like. From there, I created a specific mythology. In Nightmares and Daydreams, our creator is referred to as the Supreme Being, and there is no conventional belief system from the real world that we understand, such as religion. The Supreme Being placed some of us on the Earth’s surface and others within it. Some characters in this story possess special skills to combat the Agarthans, and from there, we create their characters based on real-life situations.

What’s the challenge when creating Nightmares and Daydreams, if any? 

The focus of the story and characters varies significantly from one episode to the next. So, the main challenge lies in how making these seven episodes feels like creating seven different films within one season, despite limited resources in terms of production time, budget, and the team involved.

You’ve assembled quite a cast for this series—from established names like Lukman Sardi and Nirina Zubir to emerging talents like Anne Yasmine—can you elaborate on the process of forming this ensemble?

I also happened to be the casting director for Nightmares and Daydreams. From the beginning of the development process, I plotted and created a wishlist for each character and who would be suitable to portray them. Many of the cast members are actors I’ve collaborated with several times before, such as Fachry Albar, Ario Bayu, Marissa Anita, Faradina Mufti, and others whom we cast through the usual audition process. Additionally, I discovered several fresh faces in the Indonesian acting scene during auditions for this series.

Whenever your new work is released, there’s always a phenomenon where numerous people on X rush to create their own theories, attempting to interpret the story’s events. What are your thoughts on this?

I’ve never explicitly asked viewers to search for easter eggs or hints in my films or series, but they always seem to come up with their own theories. Every detail is carefully considered in crafting a film or series; nothing is included purely for decoration. For instance, whether it’s a table or a chair on set, each element serves a purpose beyond mere aesthetics—it enriches the story or provides deeper insights into the characters. Rooms and locations, in particular, offer profound glimpses into individuals through their stylistic choices.

In filmmaking, visuals and art direction should tell the story of the characters and scenes. This is why the films or series I create often provoke deep discussions among viewers. Every detail is meant to tell a story and strengthen the characters.

Speaking of fan theories, this morning, I commented on a YouTube channel discussing theories that I believe closely match what’s in the Nightmares and Daydreams bible.

What can we expect if there’s a next season, and what are the plans for this series moving forward?

My vision for this series is to expand beyond Indonesia and explore Nightmares and Daydreams in other countries, delving into issues specific to each location. This approach would lead to the formation of Antibodies that unite against the Agarthans before the characters engage in their battle. I think that would be very interesting.